Rabies
Also see the title General Info and Warnings in the Medical category
Date: Wed, 02 Dec 1998 12:42:44 -0600 Subject: FEL-L: Rabies
If anyone is bitten/scratched the shots for rabies are in the arm once a week for x weeks, not the old stomach shots.
Also, if the animal who scratches or bites someone is an endangered species; tiger, lion, leopard, etc, anyone who kills it is in violation of the law & faces a year in jail & $100,000 fine. This includes vets, animal control officials, politicians, etc.
The animal can be quarantined, destroying it is not necessary unless it is sick.
This information we got directly from the USDI rep. in Kansas. Check with your own for verification.
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 13:04:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
A quick note on Rabies.
Rabies is -skin- transmissable. That means it only takes a lick, not a scratch or a bite to transmit the disease. One of the reasons it's so hard to stamp out. And there -is- an approved vacine for wild animals, the USDA developed one with our tax dollars. However, we're not allowed to buy it or use it. The rumor is, if we were allowed to have it, those places that have banned exotics because there 'is no approved rabies vaccine', would be very upset. Hence the USDA won't allow us to have this vaccine, even though we paid for it with our taxes and fees.
I have been told the USDA is using this vaccine in an effort to stamp out Rabies in the wild, don't know much more about it though. And yes there is a rabies Vaccine for humans, all USDA inspectors are vaccinated.
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 22:20:28 -0500 Subject: FEL-L: rabies vaccine
The USDA rabies vaccine is being tested in several states to help control the spread of rabies in the wildlife population. It is given in an oral form and put in "baits" for the animals to eat. It seems to be working quite well, but it is much newer than most of the injectable rabies vaccine and still in the testing stages. I think we have a better chance with the IMRAB vaccine by Merial. It has been approved for use in some exotics. I do not know if any testing is being done with exotic cats for approval with them though. It might be worth looking into.
Date: Wed, 2 Dec 1998 23:42:04 -0800 Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
Animals that are bred in captivity are not eligible for protection under the endangeres species act. A person would think that this would protect animals in captivity but it does not, ask a lawyer.
The quarantine period does not apply here because cats can be carriers of the disease for up to 60 days before showing any outward and obvious symptoms. If they waited that long to start rabies shots the person would be dead before the quarantine period was over. Who do you think would win that battle. We know what is the right thing to do but what do you think would really happen?
> This information we got directly from the USDI rep. in Kansas. Check
I got my information from the District Office in Portland, Oregon and through researching several medical journals that explain the diseases process through the body. Maybe opinions vary from one office to another within the USDI offices. Not a pretty picture. Glenda :)
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 11:49:22 EST Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
<< To the best of my knowledge any human can be vaccinated for rabies by your own doctor. They may think you are strange but oh well.
This is true unless you have an auto immune illness and are advised against it. There are a series of 3 sub Q. shots it doesn't hurt. You have to get it done every 3 years or if you draw blood and the titer is low. Because of dealing with rabies vector animals, raccoons, skunks etc.. I have to have them. Your local health department may be cheaper. I thing mine were $50.00 each. Not too expensive when you consider the alternative. Sherry:)
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 98 15:41:53 -0000 Subject: FEL-L: Rabies vax and wild populations
I tried to get hold of the oral rabies vax. Even with the help of a vet, I couldn't get any. Don't know why. I wanted it because there are possums and raccoons in the area. I've never seen skunks, but I've smelled them enough, so they may be here, too. Since these beasts live in my yard, and eat my veggie garden, I just wanted them to be healthy. No can do.
I was also warned about trapping them and giving them the vax I use on cats. When I go trapping, I sometimes get possums or raccoons in the trap, so I thought, Why not? It seems they tend to *get* rabies from that vaccine. At least, that's how it was explained to me.
So, I have to really watch my cats, even the ferals. It would be a lot easier if I could just give the others the oral vaccine. Debbie
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 19:29:33 EST Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
<< cats can be carriers of the disease for up to 60 days
This is a misconception. Rabies virus is relatively slow moving through the system. It attacks the centeral nervous system. A domestic cat for example; can be bitten on the end of it's tail by a rabid skunk, it can take up to one year before that cat sheds the virus. The closer to the brain the bite occurs the faster it will be shed. The virus has to get to the brain first, then it is shed in the saliva glands at this stage the cat can infect another with rabies. It is NOT communicable UNTIL this stage of the disease. The longest an animal has been known to live at this stage is 8 days. Most animals die within 2-3 days of the beginning of this stage. An animal can be a carrier but the disease is not transmittable until the last stage. Symptoms are not present until this last stage. Once symptoms appear death is imminent.
Humans have only 10 days max to be vaccinated after being bitten by a rabid animal or they will die. Rabies is 100% fatal if not treated in time. Only one person has ever been know to survive rabies it was a lab tech. Rabies once was call hydrophobia or fear of water. It appeared that animals and people would try and drink then would have an adversion to water. The throat actually has spasms and the victim is unable to swallow. The in ability to swallow is why some victims salivate or appear to "foam" at the mouth. I have dealt with 100's of rabid animals and have only seen 2 that actually "foamed" at the mouth. One was a dog the other was a cow. There are 2 forms rabies can take, furious form and dumb form. In the furious form the animal is aggitated and aggressive (I saw a a skunk chasing a dog and a raccoon chasing a herd of deer, one raccoon was attacking tractor trailers as they whizzed by on the highway) In the dumb form the animal appears depressed, staggers and will often approach humans or follow loud noises such as cars or voices. (last Tues I had a raccoon with dumb form, he folowed my voice or any other movement had spasms of the throat and tremors as well as other central nervous system symptoms). Farmers are more often at risk because they will stick their arm down a cows throat thinking that it is choking on something thus exposing themseves through the rabid cows saliva.
To sum this up, hope it isn't to confusing:
If you get bit by an animal that is a carrier but is NOT in the last stages of the disease you are not going to contract rabies. This is why most quarantines for animals are for 10 day with vaccination and 60 - 90 days with out vaccination. If the animal dies with in 10 days it most likely has rabies, 60 - - 90 days to see if it will develop the disease. If the animal has active rabies it will die before 10 days.
Anything with hair or fur can get rabies (mammals) no other animal can contract the disease. The most common wildlife carriers in the USA.. Fox, raccoon, skunk, and bat. Opossums have an unsually low body temp that is not conducive for the virus to live in the opossums system. It is very unsual for them to get rabies. The virus itself is pretty fragile and has to have a warm environment in which to live. It is killed by soap and water topically. Sherry:)
Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 23:20:11, -0500 Subject: FEL-L: Rabies
The African Wild Dog has been wiped out in certain areas of Africa due to rabies. They are currently doing testing on Rabies Vacc. for them. So far no luck. The vaccine only is lasting 4 months in the dogs. Much more testing is needed.
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 00:02:56 -0500 Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies vax and wild populations
Debbie, as long as a killed virus rabies vaccine is used there is no danger of an animal getting rabies from it. The only risk is when a modified live vaccine is used. Most if not all rabies vaccine these days is killed virus. It would say on the label.
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 00:12:31 -0800 Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
The medical journals and the Vets and human doctors I have spoke with both said that a carrier can transmit the disease even though there are no outward signs. Yes it may take longer for the person who is bitten to show outward signs also but like you said once that happens it is too late. This is also why many states won't let people have foxes, raccoons, skunks, or bats as pets. I am not saying I might not be wrong on this but I know what I researched and was told by a number of people on the subject.
The difference between the dumb and furious stage is only a few days. This is why some people who have been bitten by a rabid animal will describe the animal as almost unnaturally friendly and say that the animal did not make any attempt to get away from them and actually seemed docile and friendly. In a couple more days they get to the furious stage
Here again you cannot vaccinate a wild cat for rabies there isn't one available and even if you give one to the cat it is still not legally approved and in our human society it is still looked at as an unvaccinated animal.
Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 08:17:20 -0600 Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
I wanted to stay out of the discussion of rabies but I must put in my two cents worth. If some one is bitten or scratched do anything you can do to quarantine the animal. do not let them decapitate your animal. the rabies virus is a very fragile virus. You can take the saliva of a rabid animal and expose it to air for about (estimate) 20-30 seconds and it will be dead. this is a fact that most Department of health do not want you to know. if say a caracal has rabies and id drooling. before the saliva can fall from the animals mouth to the ground the virus is dead. So never fall prey to the scare tactics and allow "them" to put your animal down and send the brain matter off for a fluoroscope. Do anything you have to in order to make it just be a quarantine. in 60 days when all is well you will still have your cat. I watched the health department put down over 20 of my animals (a lot carrying offspring) and not a one came back positive.
Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 13:05:16 EST Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
<< I wanted to stay out of the discussion of rabies but I must put in my two
Where do you live and under what circumstances did this occur? What an awful thing to have happen.
The recommendation from the AVMA and NASPHV for animal on exhibit or in a zoological setting have a quarantined period for a minimum of 180 days if that animal has been wild caught. If any animal is known to had direct contact with a confirmed rabid animal the recommendation (NASPHV) is immediate euthaniza or If the animal is unvaccinated and exposed to a rabid animal it can be quarantined. the quarantine period is not 60 days but 6 months, in a double penned strict quatantine and vaccinated against rabies one month before release. If the animal has been vaccinated and in contact with a rabid animal, it is revaccinated then the confinement is 90 days observation. In the case of a healthy captive animal (dog-cat) vaccinated or not, biting a human the recommendations are; 10 day confinement period.
Date: Sun, 6 Dec 1998 01:09:06 EST Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
I have a question about the spread of rabies. Can a predator contact rabies by killing and consuming an affected animal? I would think that an animal with the "dumb" form would make for easy pickins for a predator. Or is the virus only communicable via the bloodstream? I was a prevet and have teched on and off for years, but this was never a question that occured to any of us to ask.
Date: Sun, 6 Dec 1998 23:22:44 -0500 Subject: Re: FEL-L: Rabies
>Can a predator contact rabies by killing and consuming an affected animal?
The answer to your question is YES!! Any contact with blood or saliva to an open wound or mucous membranes can transmit the virus. There have been cases where a hunter killed a deer, not knowing it was rabid, got cut while butchering the deer , and contracted rabies. There has also been some debate as to whether or not birds of prey can or have contracted the virus from killing rabid animals. To my knowledge none have been documented in the wild, but I have heard of laboratory tests being done that demonstrated this possibility.
Date: Mon, 7 Dec 1998 09:50:57 EST Subject: Re: FEL-L: rabies (sorry)
>If it is Bodily fluids, then what about the spray of a skunk? Urine? >>
No, you can't contract rabies normally from body fluids such as skunk spray, urine or feces. Blood is a low risk material. Again it is saliva, brain tissue spinal and CNS tissues that are the normal path. There have been only a couple of cases where the pathogen was air borne and several cases where people have contracted rabies from infected persons through cornea transplants.
<< if you get bit the best thing to do is scrub the bite with disenfectant. This can actually prevent the virus. Of course the Health Dept wont care. >>
This isn't true about it being preventive. Yes the wound needs to be thoughly washed.
RABIES PREVENTION US 1998 (ACIP) Recommendations: "The essential components of rabies postexposure prophylaxis are local wound treatment and the administration, in most instances, of both HRIG and vaccine.Persons who have been bitten by animals suspected or proven rabid should begin treatment within 24 hours." Incubation periods of >1 year have been reported.
National Association of State Public Health Veterinarians (NASPHV) 1998 Follows the ACIP "Rabies in humans can be prevented either by eliminating exposure to rabid animals or by providing exposed persons with prompt local treatment of wounds combined with appropriate passive and active immunization."
Remember that without post exposure prophylaxis rabies is 100% fatal. I don't know about you, but I sure wouldn't want to sweat it out to see if I cleaned a bite wound well enough to prevent death. :)
I hope this clears so things up. I believe you are in a low risk area for rabies in Calif . You most likely have good rabies prevention program with vaccinations of pets. It is rare for vets or people to encounter rabies in low risk areas that have good prevention programs and laws. Rabies is in the wild population but not the domestic populations that visit your vet. Where you run into trouble is areas such as mine, where people do not vaccinate their pets, their is no leash law and the rabies laws are not enforced, there is a high incident of rabies in the wild populations. This increases the chance of rabies from the wild population being transmitted to the community.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:59:45 EDT Subject: Re: FEL-L: Re: Rabies
I have been contacted by several folks on this list to jump in here about the rabies thing. My apologies to those who have heard this dissertation a zillion times. For those who don't know, I lecture on rabies awareness and have worked with 100's of rabid and rabies vector animals. Anyone wanting my quote references please check the archives of this list.
*Rabies is a virus that affects the central nervous system.
*Only mammals can get rabies. This is because the virus must incubate at a certain temperature. Opossums seldom get rabies because there body temp is lower than most mammals.
*Rabies virus is a slow moving virus in the system.
*Rabies can be contracted from bites, scratches, licks, that are received from an infected animal, there has been documentation of contracting it through inhalation.
*You cannot tell by just observation if an animal has rabies.
*Dogs and cats who have had at least 2 rabies vaccinations will (typically) have an immunity to the disease.
*Anything that contracts rabies WILL die from rabies it is 100 % fatal in unvaccinated animals and in humans after 9 days of bite if no vaccine is given.
*Bats do carry rabies because they "hang " together and groom each other it is quickly spread in a colony. They are not the leading vectors.
*Skunks, raccoons, and foxes are the most common wildlife vectors but all mammals can contract it.
*Unvaccinated cats are more likely than dogs to get rabies because they tolerate wildlife where dogs will kill a wild intruder.
*The closer to the brain a bite from an infected animal occurs the faster the victim will die.
A victim is NOT contagious until the rabies virus has moved through the system and reached the brain. Once it has reached the brain it affects the central nervous system and is then "shed" in the saliva glands. It is only then that the animal can spread the disease. Only during this phase is an animal symptomatic of rabies. Once the virus has reached this point the animal WILL NOT LIVE any more than a few days.
If a person who is bit by a rabid animal they have only 9 days to get the gamma globulin shot or they WILL DIE. If an animal who has bitten someone is put up for 10 days and did not die in that time period then it was not in the active stage of rabies or shedding the virus. This doesn't mean it still isn't a carrier of rabies, only that it wasn't contagious at the time of bite.